What Then Say You
Welcome to the show! In this podcast my wife and I have candid conversations about various topics that will encourage and at times challenge you! The greatest conversations ever had are typically amongst friends in an intimate setting. This is the venue in which the Holy Spirit often works to separate the chaff from the wheat in our lives if we are being honest with ourselves. We hope as you peer behind the veil and join us that you take what you hear and consider it with Gods word in your own life.
What Then Say You
Salvation Is Not Passive, So Now What
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
If you’ve ever wondered why you still struggle after you “did all the right things,” you’re not alone. We sit down as husband and wife and get honest about a misconception that quietly breaks a lot of believers: the idea that salvation means growth will just happen to you while you wait. We talk about the tension between grace and effort, why “trying” is not automatically legalism, and how real Christian discipleship requires awake, daily participation with the Holy Spirit.
We lean on Ephesians 6 and the Armor of God, using a soldier analogy that makes it click: nobody goes to war wearing gym clothes with a single weapon. You gear up, on purpose. Paul’s language is the same, take it up, put it on, carry it, stand. We also take on the shallow version of “it is finished” and ask the hard question: finished for what? We connect Hebrews, James, and Romans 13 to show how faith and obedience work together, why “make no provision for the flesh” is so direct, and how God’s light exposes what we keep trying to excuse.
Then we bring it into real life: phones, ads, scrolling, desires that start small and end up owning your attention. Spiritual warfare often feels like an insurgency, constant, subtle, hard to identify, and exhausting. We close by reframing holiness as servanthood, resisting the urge to treat people like the enemy, and choosing to stay children of the day who are aware, accountable, and ready to love the person in front of us.
If this challenged you, share it with a friend, subscribe so you don’t miss the next conversation, and leave a review that tells us what part hit home most.
Feel free to check us out over on YouTube!! Be sure to subscribe to stay in the loop!
What Then Say You - YouTube
Welcome Behind Closed Doors
SPEAKER_00Hey, thanks for joining my husband and I as we invite you behind our closed doors discussing our faith, our walk, our family, and what it means to be set apart and at times being unbiblically difficult. What then say you?
SPEAKER_01Hey, good morning, good evening, good afternoon, whatever time it is. Thank you so much for tuning in to the podcast. Um, wow, I have not said that in a long time, but it's all good because we're here now. We're back and um plan on being here for however long God has us to do
The Misconception About Instant Change
SPEAKER_01this. Um, and with that, I kind of wanted to talk to about something that we've actually been talking about for a little while now, but um it's something that I I I guess how do I put it? God kind of led me down this path of misconceptions that we often get really, really wrong, and um misconceptions that are even led in the church sometimes, um and just misconceptions about our faith holistically, right? When we believe in Jesus, we have this idea, or at least I had, and I'm gonna only speak for me because I don't know about anybody else, but I had this idea, this thought that when I when I came to Christ, that you know, I knew all my sins were washed away, I got baptized, I did all the things, and then like change would just come upon me over time, you know, and I'd pray for things that I I thought were bad or that I thought needed to go, and then it would just go because Jesus, because the Holy Spirit. Um, and because also I I hear in the church or in the lingo sometimes, like, well, if I'm doing too much work, be careful with our works, right? Because the works is legalistic, and then you fall under the category of being legalistic if I am trying to do a thing, right? And so there's this always this huge place of of unrest and and non-confidence or lack of confidence when it came down to where's the line between the work and where's the line between the faith and how am I supposed to live this thing out? Because when I look out across all the different denominations, across all the different um platforms out there, everybody has some type of varying opinion on it. And so obviously, you got to go back to the word. You go back to the word to kind of figure out where's the line between what you have to do versus what God is gonna do in you. And here I am so many years in the faith. Here I am, you know, being called to teach and preach the word of God and encourage everybody, right? Everybody that I encounter in my life. Um, and this is one thing that God has really just been settling in my spirit. Um, and I'll start one with this analogy, uh, so that that way Tanisha can get the chatting on this one.
Self-Defense And A Soldier’s Readiness
SPEAKER_01But this analogy came from when we were talking about self-defense, right? Like I'm if you don't know anything about me, former military guy, so I'm always I'm a big gun guy, gun advocate, all the things, right? And I had to be confronted with this notion about how much trust that I have in the Lord to defend me versus myself defending me. And I can go through scriptures and this isn't what this is about today, but I can go through scriptures and so on and so forth and say, hey, well, this is where it says, and this is where it says, but either way, I got to thinking about just the idea of carrying a gun, a handgun, right? From as a soldier, whenever I would go outside the wire, I wouldn't just have a rifle. I wouldn't just have a handgun the way we carry handguns today in America, right? I would have on a helmet, body armor, water pack, knee pads, like all types of the boots. I was equipped from head to toe with everything that I needed to have on to actually go to war to fight a tangible enemy, right? The weapon is of in and of itself was just that, but there was a lot of other things that I had to have on my person uh in order to be efficient at what I was doing. You could you would never see a soldier running around somewhere with just a rifle in his PT shorts and PT shirt talking about I'm about to go into a firefight, right? And so when we think about Paul, when we think about the different things that he's talked about, um whether it be we're at war against the principalities um and the things unseen, you know, the analogies just became clearer and clearer to me. And it wasn't until you um brought up the armor of God. And you were talking about do you do realize that you have to put on the actual armor? It's not just something that is a default skin, as my my oldest son would say. It's not just like some type of default skin that you just get equipped with when you become a believer in Christ. You're not just automatically inherent with the the helm, the helmet, the breastplate of righteousness, and
You Have To Put On Armor
SPEAKER_01so on and so forth. And so I'm just gonna quickly read Ephesians 6 um chapter 3 verse 13 uh down into verse 17. It says, So take up every piece of war equipment God provides, so that when the evil day comes, you will be able to resist. And when the battle is won, you will be standing. And just to pause there for a quick moment, it just says, so that when the evil day comes, that is a guarantee. When the evil day comes, it's coming, just be on the lookout for it. It's gonna happen. Verse 14, therefore stand, have the belt of truth buckled around your waist, put on righteousness for a breastplate, and wear on your feet the readiness that comes from the good news of peace. Always carry the shield of trust, with which you will be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one, and take the helmet of deliverance, along with the sword given by the Spirit, that is the Word of God. As you pray at all times, with all kinds of prayers and requests in the Spirit, vigilantly and persistently for all God's people. Looking at that analogy, looking at the words of Paul in that moment, there's so much there that can easily be overlooked, overshadowed by prosperity, by God's blessings, um, by so many things. But there's some tasks there, some simple tasks, some difficult tasks, depending upon your level of faith, that is required of us as believers. You have any
What “Finished” Actually Means
SPEAKER_01thoughts?
SPEAKER_00Well, I think um I won't go too hard on the Ephesians part of it. Um, because I think many people who are familiar with the Bible and this teaching are familiar with the armor of God. And many people, there's different ways that people teach the armor of God and you know, remind people of the armor of God, but not really tell them why they need the armor of God, so on and so forth. But I kind of want to go into just back in the beginning where you were talking about coming into salvation, coming to a place of belief, and then what do you do with the belief? And then I think the first thing is I think the biggest action that we have that's caused to us by God is faith, right? Um, and I think the issue that we have is when we say that the action word is faith, we're like, Well, what does faith look like? So what do I do with that action word? Yeah. And I I think the biggest thing, uh, you know, the thing that you hear is, you know, it's already done, it was finished on the cross, you know, this. And so immediately, so you have a lot of different denominations like, well, since it's already done, there's nothing else to be done. So therefore it's all finished, the work was on the cross, and then you have to ask what was done on the cross. So what what are we saying finished? Because the here's the argument, right? Because it was done, Jesus fulfilled the law, there's nothing else for me to do. I'm G, I'm going to heaven, right? And then and the thing that hits me in this moment is that he says he's going to bring many sons to glory through suffering. So then I I'm I'm I'm in that moment reminded that something's not done, right? What's not done? Because if that's the case, what is he doing, right? And if we think about bringing sons to glory through suffering, then what and then we have to ask ourselves, then why is God bringing me, his son, or his daughter to glory? Yeah. So that's Hebrews, right? So what's been glorified in me? That's the key. If he's bringing us to glory through suffering, then what's been glorified? Let's go back to what we said the work was finished at the cross. So if it was finished and there's nothing left for me to do, what's going to be glorified through me? Yeah. Right? Now the question is if somebody says, Well, it's finished, there's nothing else to do, Jesus fulfilled the law, we don't have anything else left to do but our lives, we're good. Then the answer to that person would be the only thing that's going to probably be glorified through me past what was done at the cross is sin. Because if I say that everything was done at the cross, and there's nothing left for me to do, and remember I say action word is faith, there's nothing left for me to do, and I don't understand the action word of faith, right? Faith is about of uh faith that's what that's unseen, right? But it was Abraham who was counted as faith through his, you know, or righteousness was counted as faith. Yep, immediately I'm saying as the person who says there's nothing left for me to do, because of faith, I'm saved, I'm gonna have a glorified, sinful person in front of me.
SPEAKER_01Dang, right?
SPEAKER_00I don't know what the work of the cross meant when I do that. I'm just saying it's done, you know. And so you got a lot of teachers who are like, Yeah, you know, like why is everybody constantly telling people they got stuff to do? It's done. You know, and then I and then I would venture to say if if if that were the only answer, then I figure the New Testament would have been done right after Jesus went up. Because now we don't have a reason for the you know, the church to come to a place together, we don't have a reason for Pentecost, we don't have a reason for Paul to have to go send out to the Gentiles, like none of that makes any more sense. Like it's that's that's that's that has no purpose anymore. Um in that case, my salvation would be in vain, right? I don't have a reason to be the salt of the earth, I don't have a reason to be the light of the world. I am just because what are you glorifying if the work is finished and you don't have anything to do, and like I said, if you're that answer, then your answer is sin. So then how are you now the light of the world? How are you the salt of the earth? What what what are you doing to be that is my next question. Because what enters in void of that thought, and it and and I'm gonna use a religious way of doing it, I'm not gonna use a a um a uh a heathen's way, secular worldly way. Yeah, I'm gonna say you're gonna start trying to work something out. Yeah, right? Let's just imagine if your salvation started when you were young, like maybe in the teens, right? And you're living to like you're like what 80, and you're saying, alright, it's done, I'm going to heaven. One of two things is gonna happen. You're you're gonna be impressed upon by the Holy Spirit, which is poured out on all flesh, right? To feel something inside of you, some type of burden in you that something more needs to happen.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right? Because something about that cross does matter.
SPEAKER_01I'm just gonna say whether that's church or you start volunteering more, you start to do it.
SPEAKER_00Something about that cross is gonna matter to you, right? Or you're going to, if you really don't get it, and your teacher in front of you or your pastor in front of you is really not helping you, you're just gonna live your life, right? And then you're gonna go back to your old ways. You're gonna go back to doing what you already did because you have no reason to be rid of sin, if that's the teaching, right? Like it's done. There's nothing left for me to do. When you read the put the put on in Ephesians, right? And you and you go and I think it crosses over that same Ephesians thought process crosses over, I think, the Colossians, and yeah, and probably even if you go, well, when the punishment happened stuff, but when you read the put on, there's some actionable things happening. Um, and that's what he was kind of referring to with what I'm talking about. You there's some things that have to take place through us to maintain what it means to be saved, to glorify the Lord in our life. Yeah, there's some actionable things that have to take place. It's not just that I have faith and it's pointless, right? What does it say in James? Faith without works is dead, right? It's so funny because you'll hear teachers say, Oh, it's all done. And then you see James say that, and it's just like, what in the world?
SPEAKER_01It can get confusing real quick, yeah.
SPEAKER_00But then the works are like dirty rags in the old testament. So, what works was James talking about? Okay, so like, and then remember like the green grass that goes to the grass, you know, it pair it goes away. That's Isaiah. Like, so what just happened? If if James is saying faith without works is dead, yeah, then that's that's saying that I must work. Right. But then I also am understanding this is a faith walk, and there's no legalistic byproduct to this wall because now we're under a moral law. So now faith matters, work matter, but what work am I doing if it's not dirty deeds, right? Like grass like dirty. Well, I guess the issue that I'm gonna have in this moment is I'm gonna probably have to read most of everything that this new testament is telling me and figure out some actionable words. I think the thing that I used or that I tried to do recently is I would go through this New Testament and I and I was talking the reason why he brought this, I was sitting out like, man, did you notice like most of the time when you read it, it's like do something. Yeah, right? Paul, and we when you think about the love verse, you know, um love is patient, love is kind, right? So those are things you you gotta be. You some people sit silent, well, it's gonna be patient, it's gonna be kind. I just gotta wait on it. Yeah, no, you gotta put that into work. Like, there is no like, I wish that worked that way. I mean, with all the situation we've had, I wish it was that I could just sit down and love would be enduring and I would suffer and I wouldn't hold any records and you know, like all these things. But then you hear this other word, right? Cast down any imagination and anything that exalts itself before God. Wait a second, so like somehow, somehow, there's something that has to be done for love to even work out, right? Um, and then there's um I'm I'm in Romans right now, right? And it's it's funny because Paul says, I think in verse or chapter 13 in verse 8, he says, Oh no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. Wait a second, you just use the word law, but you said Jesus fulfilled it, but then you just said that if I love somebody and I love my brother, then I'm gonna fulfill the law, right? Okay, I think the issue we're having is Jesus fulfilled the law so that it would be fulfilled in us and through us. It's not necessarily that he fulfilled the law and he was done away with it, right? And and and I I don't I'm I'm gonna say that as best I can because I don't want to use terms that turn people back into legalism. Again, it's a moral law. That means there's gonna be some convictions that's gonna take place in my life. There's gonna be a place of God's mercy that's gonna continue, like his mercy endures forever. What that means is he's gonna continue to check my spirit, he's gonna continue to say, Hey, Tanisha, here's some something you need to do. You need to work on that. You know, if I go sit and spend time with God, he is definitely faithful to reveal me areas I need to work on in my life. And I think a lot of us don't want to deal in that area either, because it's like, well, then that's a work. It's like, yeah, it is, but it's done. It's for you. Like Jesus has poured everything out into you now to be able to do it. Like, there's no, like, there's no excuse for us anymore. There's no place we can say, I'm gonna put that to the side, and then maybe he'll fix that. And what's scary about that thought process, that's what I'm talking to. But what's scary about that thought process is and we think God is gonna fix that, and we just sit down, right, and he doesn't fix it, we say, well, then he's okay with me doing it. Like if he doesn't take care of that, then he's okay with me doing that. And then I I just like to know what's been glorified.
SPEAKER_01Well, see, I think we we we want, we see Jesus do the do the miracles, right? We see him come up to the leper, boom, he's clean. We see him come up to the woman with the issue of the blood. She touched him, boom, she's clean, everything's good. And so we're wanting that immediate, you know, this this uh blasphemous generation, right? We we're always looking for a sign of the miracles, but we want that immediate release of whatever thing that we acknowledge as evil in our lives, you know.
SPEAKER_00But but see, that's this that's the scary part. You said what we acknowledge as evil. I'm here to tell you that we can't acknowledge the difference between good and evil if we want to justify the evil. Because it's too easy for me to say this is okay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because technically, I have the spirit of God. Remember, I'm saved. Technically, I know what I'm talking about. Uh, Paul said no one can judge him, not even he can judge himself, right? And we'll start using those scriptures like you know, you can't judge me, and then no one else can judge me, and I can't even judge myself. I'm just moving in faith. So, like, if I do that, it's just faith, right? Like, yeah, you know, I mean we can justify sin. Yeah, we can justify sin to an to an extent that we don't think we have it anymore, right?
SPEAKER_01And I think But I think that that points directly to what ends up happening, right? And that's why I think this this verse, uh these verses on the the the armor, right, or the what they call pieces of war equipment, right? What they call is so so pivotal because that now you exposed. Because guess what you don't have on? You don't have on righteousness anymore, right? Because in pursuit of righteousness, which some churches do a great job of teaching righteousness and holiness and so on and so forth, and and death to self, but righteousness is one of those areas that easily you can because you've justified sin so much and then claim faith, and you have this perverse way of looking at righteousness, as in I'm righteous because I believe in Jesus, the end, or my father in heaven is righteous, and because I believe in him, therefore I'm righteous, so I'm always covered. When in reality, there there is a death itself that has to happen in order to achieve righteousness. Yeah, the pursuit of righteousness.
SPEAKER_00That's what I'm
Holiness Looks Like Servanthood
SPEAKER_00saying. The the key here is the holiness aspect, right? And I think we asked if if the question is, what does it mean to be holy? Yeah, right, what does it mean to be righteous? That's the question. Like we could go through a list of you know, X, Y, Z, but what the answer is what Jesus did, because at the end of the day, he told us to be servants of all. Like he was servant to all, so he calls us to be servants. And I think the the equation is holiness is servanthood. And it's just like until I can get to that level of serving people, until I can get to and that was my biggest struggle. Until I can get to that level of just saying, okay, the only thing I need to do is die to myself so that when God puts anyone in front of me, I can serve them, yeah, then that means I've left let go of me. That means I have let go of the idea of what I can gain in this world, what I what I can gain through God, what I can be blessed with. Like, yeah, I think if God can put someone in front of me and I can be concerned about that individual and not have, you know, no, no, is it no hose barred or what y'all say? You know, you know, like and just do something for that person, or you know, God can just like do whatever He needs to do through me for him or her, then I know that I'm at that level now where I can be used, and that's where faith is hidden. Faith is like, you're at a level now where it's just like that is my holiness. Right. That goes that's why I want to point out the love. The love for one another was the commandment, right? That was the thing that we're supposed to be getting fulfilled through us. It's like the the power here is being able to love the person in front of you without being concerned about you, without being concerned about what that looks like for you. You know, it's too easy for us to talk about marriage. Well, you know, submit, you know, and then do this and all this other stuff. But the reality is that's a practice relationship, yeah, right, of what love looks like. And then if you have children, that's a practiced relationship about sacrificial love, right? Or if you have a dear friend or a beloved, you know, family member, that's a practiced relationship. But the ultimate goal is not to not to love, like Jesus said, not to love the person just because they love you back, but to just love them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right? And and and so you don't consider the lack of love you have as darkness. You don't, and and I and that's why I want to keep going forward, even while I'm in Romans 13. You don't consider that as a as a dark thing. You consider that as a uh God's working on that in me. That's just something that he's working on. You know, I I struggle with that person today, I respond to that person today like this, but you know, God got me, you know. Instead of sitting in the at the end of your night and examining yourself and saying, why did that take place? Why do I still have that part of me in me? Why was I still able to quickly bite back at that person or that individual? Why was I able to snap or why wasn't I concerned about whether or not that person ate anything, you know, like joking. But no, like the point I'm making is those are things that God allows to happen because he's bringing us to the attention of what's going on in our lives. Those are things that he's quickly saying, hey, here's where you're you're struggling, here's where you're dealing with, you know, this is a faith walk. And so in order for you to be faithful, you must obey and listen and watch. You must be able to pay attention to the things that are happening, you know, quick, you know, to obey, like slow to anger, quick to forgive, right?
Cast Off Darkness, Put On Light
SPEAKER_00And I think as I go for it, it says, and do this, knowing the time that now it is high time to awake out of sleep. For now our salvation is nearer than we first believe. The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Watch this. We're about to do some action. Therefore, let us cast off the works of darkness and let us put on the armor of light.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Tie that back into your Ephesians, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'm about to.
SPEAKER_00Let us walk properly as in the day, not in revelry and drunkenness, not in lewdness and lust, not in strife and envy, but put on the Lord Jesus Christ, make no provision for the flesh to fulfill its lusts.
SPEAKER_01And I think that's pretty because it says, We are to make no provision, meaning that we ourselves, even as believers, even as being saved and baptized and speaking in tongues, however. We want to quantify our faith and our belief. This is something that we must do. We must not give space for the enemy. And I think what's pretty about that, as you were speaking, I was going to tie in that it says, always carry the shield of trust, or in other lame in other terms, faith, right? With which you will be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. And so the imagery just pops in my head when I think about that, even as even if I tie into the marriage, right? Well, if I've lost faith in my day with God, that he has me covered in my tiredness, he has even covered because my feet hurt, he has me covered in in self-protection, he has me covered, like my faith in him is the only thing that is going to be the shield against all the other thoughts that come along, or all the other lack of thoughts, like, hey, did you are you hungry, or inconsiderations that might come up? It my faith in God, my trust in him, that his provision is sufficient, is the only thing that is going to stop the arrows from meet reaching their heart uh their mark against me in that moment. And like you said, like that's how we, you know, legitimately not give choral or not give space to all those deeds of darkness, right? We don't give space to the deeds of darkness by putting on righteousness, by pursuing Christ, and by carrying, meaning we have to physically carry the shield of trust. And that shield gets heavy sometimes in a world where we see things that might not necessarily align with what we thought it was going to be or what we our expectations aren't met, right? And because we're not trusting God's actual standards. Does that make sense? Like because we have failed to trust and have faith that God's plan for our lives is good and that He has a plan and a process for everything that we're going through. When we fail to trust that and our expectations aren't met, that shield of trust gets heavier and heavier. And then the arrows start to come through that causes backbiting, that causes all the deeds of darkness to come up. Lust only comes up because I'm not getting something that I want because my expectations aren't being met. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00And even if you think about the armor of light, right?
Why People Avoid The Light
SPEAKER_00Even go back to John 3.16. John 3.16, I want to turn to it, but I'm just gonna try to go there. For God so loved the world that he gave his only son, so whoever so believed in him should have eternal life, right? And then we go to the next verse, you know. I always like to go and kick note it always like to go to the next verse right after because when I think about this part in Romans 13 when he says, Let us put on the armor of light, let us walk properly as in the day, not in reveling and drunkness.
SPEAKER_01Where's the one that It says, For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but rather so that through him the world might be saved. Those who trust in him are not judged, those who do not trust have been judged already, and that they have not trusted in the one who is in who is God's only and unique son.
SPEAKER_00But then it says, Now, this is the judgment.
SPEAKER_01The light has come into the world, but people love the darkness rather than the light. Why? Because their actions were wicked. For everyone who does evil things hate the light and avoids it, so that his actions won't be exposed.
SPEAKER_00That why is this important? And why is Paul repeating this, even though this is already here? Because this is not really something that's new. Yeah. Why is he doing this? Because he was like, the light is the thing that keeps you out of the darkness. The light is the thing that makes you put away the dark deeds. The light, the light isn't allowing God to shine his light on you is allowing God to reveal the evil in you. Allowing God to be able to show you who you really are before his eyes. Um and to be able to know that, okay, that's his way of saying that I still have darkness. Remember, I can't remember another verse, it's another verse, but I can't, but he went into a place and it was like, you know, they didn't want the light there, and it was just like if wherever he brings the light, you know, light overcomes darkness, right? Like there's no, if I'm allowing Jesus to come into my life and shed his light abroad and me, shed his love abroad in me through the Holy Spirit, there's no way that I can still remain in dark. There's no way. Light overtakes the darkness, right? Not not the other way around. We we we joke, but it's facts. If you go into a dark, dark, dark room and you make it pitch black, your eyes will adjust and you'll start to see. Somehow, some way, there's still light. Yeah. Right? And and it and it's and it's a it's a thing that's super funny because and don't don't quote me on this, scientists. Don't do all that stuff. Oh no, for real, you gotta get into this type of darkness. I get what you're saying. What I'm trying to say is if we're exposing this type of scripture, and we're using the the creator's natural way of revealing things to us, which is what I'm trying to do. I don't want to use somebody's idea of science to determine what this means. I want to use God's word to determine what this means. God give us many places in scripture to tell us about the creation and what things do and why they work that way. Science is just are just in awe, so they go into a deeper way of trying to figure that out. But God gives us all these analogies, he gives us all these nature things and all this stuff, and then one thing I can tell you that remains the same is that his word is true. Therefore, darkness can't overtake light.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Okay. And so in this case, what that means is can somebody become fully dark? Yes. But not because they did not have a choice. Yeah. You hear me? Like, maybe then scientists can use that word where if you put me in a trap, trap, trap box and there is no light, then I'm like, Yeah, well, that was a choice. Like, why you get in there?
SPEAKER_01You choose you chose to keep going down the line. You know what I mean? Like you were supposed to like, but you chose and I think it's the reality right time back into what Paul was saying, uh, or as John was saying in John 3.16, and and this this verse used to be the bane of my existence, y'all. This is just transparency one-on-one. But whenever I was still like going through something in my life, Tanisha would hit me with that that verse. And I'm just gonna argue with this. Um, I think that's another thing we are afraid to have in this life is somebody that's willing to call a spade a spade and hold us accountable and let you let that word cut. But when you're doing something that you've justified, that knowingly knowing is a sin, um, or or something that you should not be doing as a believer in the word, um, you just love the darkness more than the light. And that's a reality that that many don't want to agree with because then we know it's going to contradict our faith, right? That's a contradiction statement to be like, what do you mean I love the darkness more than the light? I believe in Jesus. Obviously, I can't. No, that just means you enjoy what the thing is giving you. And that's and the reality of it is in this world, there's all types of things, right? Like to say or to assume that we cannot enjoy something in this world that appeases the flesh, that appeases our senses, is ignorant. To think that there's nothing in this world that God has deemed is bad that we won't enjoy is ignorant. Like, does that make sense what I'm trying to say? So at the end of the day, you know, pick pick a poison, pick a thing that God has clearly said you should not do, but I guarantee you it feels good to the flesh. There's all types of things out there. Even when you look at when Jesus, and sometimes it's not even bad things.
SPEAKER_00I think you even tend to fight for things more when you hear you can't do it. I think that's that's and I think that's the prettiest thing. I in my mind when we were talking earlier and I was reading the verse when it says make no provision for the flesh, um, you know, and and because if to or to fulfill his list, and I was thinking to myself, I was like, Man, you know, if you think about it, like make no provision for the flesh, that's a really, really, really powerful thing to say. Yeah. Because it's like literally, no, don't do that, you know.
Make No Provision For The Flesh
SPEAKER_00Okay, I'm gonna give y'all something because I think a lot of y'all, and if you came across even this video, you probably do it anyway, because you got a phone or you got a TV and you're looking at something, or you're hearing it, whatever. But you ever had that moment, you know, because we got a phone, we got all of us have technology, but you see, you see something, maybe it's on the news feed or something, and you're like, oh, I'm just gonna look at that one thing. And then next thing you know, two hours later, I mean they have means for this, but two hours later, you're still there, yeah, but you're not even there anymore. Like you're you went from whatever you saw, like I don't know, somebody was baking something, right? And now you're all here looking at brand new cars. Like, how did you get from baking to brand new cars? Well, that's kind of what happens when you make provision for the flesh. Yeah, you start with one thing, one small thing.
SPEAKER_01You gave space for it. Yes, that's what it means. You you yeah, you you voluntarily, and I think provision is such a powerful word because you fed it, you you provided it what it needed to be able to embrace.
SPEAKER_00But but what's interesting, you started with that thing, right? And then all of a sudden you're in a whole nother world of trouble. You that thing you started with wasn't even the thing, and you've gotten yourself into a whole nother world of trouble. Like, it's like, wait, how did I get there?
SPEAKER_01The analogy that's coming to my mind, because when we went to New Orleans once before um as a family vacation, and the little dude on the little the boat, the airboat, he was feeding these alligators marshmallows. And it's just like it's almost like I'm I'm giving these alligators marshmallows, and then all of a sudden I find myself in the swamp with alligators surrounding me now coming towards me. Because what I started off with was just, you know, feeding them this one little thing that's cute and it's innocent. But next thing you know, I've created and I've fostered this environment now where it's all types of danger around me that I'm not even aware of. I've I've given it provision to be there, I've invited it in because I just wanted to see it up close. What's wrong with that? You know, I don't know.
SPEAKER_00It's just no, it's it's right. Like, and so let's let us walk popular in the day. If we're children of the day, that means we're aware. That means we can see things. Um, I think this is pretty. He didn't say walk as children of the night. Interesting. Why? Because I at night it's dark, right? What I'm what I'm about to say is is is very important. If I'm walking as a child, uh as a child of day, then that means I notice things and I see things. And I think even maybe that's why I brought up the whole technology thing. I might need to learn that if I'm not noticing things anymore and I'm not seeing things anymore because I'm so busy doing other things, or because I'm so focused on the thing that I fulfilled in my flesh by the way of thus, that's part because I'm not walking as a child today. If I'm overwhelmed and overfocused on things that do not pertain to the things that matter, and I'm not putting away things like you know, the the night is far spent. I love that. The night is far spent, the day is at hand. You know, is another scripture where he talks about or you used to be one of them, like you you've had your time. I think that was Peter. You've had your time in the dark, and I think we don't take these verses so seriously, but it's it's a serious verse because as I brought up the technology thing, because I I had a big struggle with that, you know, technology is not evil in and of itself, right? But when you get to a place when that's the only thing, like if you got your phone and you're like, I'm here, and then two hours, three hours later, you're still here, but you're really not doing anything, yeah. Okay, I can give you one suggestion, you know. Like, I'd probably say, Hey, make no provision for the flesh. You should probably put that down. Um, and then you should practice putting it down. And you should practice putting it down more. And no, I'm not talking about put the little, what's the little thing you put screen time thing? No, you do it. You do it, you do it. Because it's it's it's it's necessary that we understand when we're talking about actions and all the things, and like if Keith, like his biggest thing is like he just loves, like, you know, all the the fancy, like I think it's why you got the cars, like the fancy cars, right? Yeah, yeah. But I told Keith one time, I was like, you know, the only reason why you really keep thinking about the car is because you keep looking at it. You did you know that that can happen? Okay, that's probably really small, simple thing, but I'm telling you the truth. Yeah, like you probably didn't want it as much as you would have if you did if you if you just stopped looking at it. Yeah. Like, and I think that's like, you know, the cake. Like you see cake, you want it now. You oh you probably on a good diet, you don't eat sugar, but now you see the cake and you want the cake, right?
SPEAKER_01Like the eye, the the eyes, you know. Well, there's plenty of scripture that covers. Yeah, that's it.
SPEAKER_00I mean, there's more, and I'm using really simple, like I said, I'm really getting really simple here, but I don't know why, but I just feel like that's something that people need to understand. It's like the first thing that God is working on is for you to be aware.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00It's for you to be aware. That's why I say it's the children of day. It's for you to be aware. Remember, I said which am I love? I said, you lack love, you're in the dark, right? Yeah. I can't be aware of people in front of me if I'm practicing dark deeds. I can't be aware of people in front of me if I'm if I'm overtaken by other things. I can't be aware and love anyone if I'm just too busy doing things that don't matter, right? So if you wanted to ask what's the first thing that God is gonna probably deal with you in, probably those things that's keeping you away from God and the people in front of you. And I think that's something that we need to go ahead.
SPEAKER_01No, yeah, no, I I'm in complete agreement. Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00I was I think that's something that we need to be more aware of. Are we children of the day? Like, are we truly aware of the people in front of us to an extent that we understand not we can get so self-focused, yeah, and self-focused, you know, like I they're just saying that people say, Oh, you know, self-love is love, you know. I think I've heard that. I don't I've heard self-love. Yeah, I think I even remember when I had my first child, Smite was like, hey, you need to make sure you take care of yourself. And I'm not saying that's wrong. But what does taking care of yourself look like? It does not look like getting overtaken in things that don't matter. Yeah, it looks like going to God, it looks like feeding on his word, it looks like sitting in prayer, it looks like you know, just letting him deal with you. That's self-love. Yeah, so that when that love is perfected with God through you, like he says, the first commandment is love God with all your heart, all your mind, soul, and spirit. The second one, now we can once we finish that self-love in the spirit, is to love your neighbor as yourself, right? Because if I practice that, now I'm gonna go point that person back to Jesus. Like, that's what I'm gonna be doing. I'm gonna love them the same way he had to love me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um, no, I think another thing just to kind of um close this one down, that just to kind of just put the put the framework back on it, right? Like we understand that our belief is step one. You know, the life lived, all the stuff that Tanisha and I were just talking about, um those are actions that we get to participate in this process with the Lord. That daily death to self, the aspects of not providing provisions to the things that are coming into our lives, um, pursuing righteousness, um, uh attempting to understand what holiness looks like, and understanding that our faith is a is a huge part um that leads to the action then that now allows us to not give provision to the enemy, to be children of the day, to always be on alert, to be able to see the needs where they might lie. Um, these are all things that we are doing. It's not, I guess, and I think that's a really beautiful thing about our faith, is it's not passive. It's not um just this, you know, passive income of blessings. Like we just once we say we believe in Jesus, we have this just never-ending passive income of blessings that just come over our lives that we don't have to do anything but sit on the couch and watch TV, but Jesus is just, hey, you know, because you remember sitting there and we're waiting on him. Or we just sitting out there.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, and even I know, sorry, that's unloving.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00If if my full focus is come, Jesus, come, and I can't wait till he hurries up and come, yeah, I'm forgetting about the people that he's still waiting on. Yeah. I'm still forgetting about the people that he's still enduring for. Like, yay, I'm glad that I'm saved, but just like that, immediately my urgency is to be can the person in front of me be saved? You know, not can Jesus be here tomorrow. I mean, granted, we hear I know why we're saying it because we have a hope, right? We have a we have a salvation to come. I mean, we have so many great things to look forward to, but we won't have other people look forward to that too. We don't want to be like, oh, hurry up and then be dismissing people here and this piece of putting, oh, I wish you to get out of my way. That goes back to your Ephesians because what did he say? The the fight is not against flesh and blood, but against the principal principalities, right? What the enemy does well is he makes us believe that we're tired of people. We're tired of people, we're just circumstances right, and the circumstances that come with people, right? And it we're so tired of it, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because you're right. Ultimately, regardless of what's going on, whether it's politics, whether it's economy, whether it's your neighbors or whatever, it all boils down to people.
SPEAKER_00Well, because they're the heart of God, man. And it and it and it and it it and it it's just the it's that's the problem. It's like if the enemy can deflect you from the very thing that God came for to include you, then he's winning.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right? Because the thing about salvation is he can't do nothing with your soul. Yeah, but he can do so much with your flesh. Yeah. And and and and that's the thing that he's that's just that's his last, like we were talking about the other day, that's his last ditch effort. Like he's like, fine, I'll just make them be bitter and unhappy and pitiful and all these other things, and hate that person and hate this person and get tired of that person and think about all the ways that person did them wrong, and and get mad at this boss and get mad at that supervisor and not want that job because this job does that, and not, you know, it's like he he does a great job getting you frustrated with those things.
SPEAKER_01And it's and it's it's a tactic as old as time. It's just a smoke screen, right? And if I can get you, if I can get you to focus over here and look over here, look over here, and you can't see what's at stake, you can't see the things that you're actually losing, then I don't really have to try that hard. You know, the thing you gotta think. I'm just gonna drop this last little nugget from my part for real, for real.
SPEAKER_00Right, right, before you drop it, hold on to it. All right, I want to make sure I say it is finished, it is done, that was done across, but what was it finished and done for? It now has given you the same thing that was in Christ in you to do what He has done. It gives you the ability to do, it gives you the ability to do. That's what's done.
SPEAKER_01That's pretty. Um yeah, that was hard to do to hold on to it, but I held on to it, y'all.
Afghanistan And The Insurgency Of Temptation
SPEAKER_01All right, so um okay, so I spent like three and three years and almost yeah, almost three years and some change in Afghanistan. We were in Afghanistan for 20 years and we left. Right? Pulled out. Yeah, I don't know if y'all remember seeing the the sad scenes of the civilians over there hanging on to the bottom of the uh airplanes as they were taking off and falling to their death because they were trying to get out of their country. And so you gotta ask yourself 20 years, you know, over 3,000 soldiers died in Afghanistan. Um, US soldiers, um, countless of thousands of people, enemy combatants and Afghan locals died in that conflict. Um, and we left and gave it back to the same people we took it from when before we showed up. Okay. I'm gonna pause for a second, but just paint this perfect picture that God is showing us how the enemy works. The reason why terrorism and insurgency and the idea of guerrilla warfare works so well is because there's no enemy in plain sight. There's no uniform, there's no, you know, we drive red vehicles, they drive green vehicles. There's this isn't, you know, US versus China, US versus Iran. These are just people. Every every person that you see could be a threat. Right? And what happens in a war like that is it it almost becomes unwinnable. Unless you kill everybody, it becomes unwinnable because you cannot successfully identify who the enemy is. Everybody's just shooting. Right? And what happens is you go weary. You go uh uh you start losing money, you start losing the ability to sustain the tempo, the opt- tempo, the operational tempo that you're trying to achieve in said battle. So now let's transfer that over into the spirit, transfer that over into how we are at war against the principalities. It is like in an insurgency. You can't clearly identify Satan in a person to say that person is obviously the enemy because it's the spirit behind the person. And if you got all these different things, I can't say that technology is evil, I can't say the cell phone is the bad thing or the app, but all I need is an ad. All I need is the thumbnail ministry where somebody's trying to get my attention. All I need is the the marketing strategist from Google to say, well, you're a 40-year-old male, you're you're married, um, or maybe you're not. Here, let me throw this stuff at you because most people are interested in this at your age. Boom, insurgency. So the fiery arrows, where you got to carry that shield of trust, they're coming at all times. And it's an insurgency that we're fighting. And the issue is that we become weary in the fight, we become tired in the fight, and then what do we do? We pull out after 20 years, and we give the enemy back control over a place that they already had control. And so when we believe in Jesus and we we've accepted him into our life, that house was cleaned out. That enemy was already kicked out. But we started giving provisions and letting them come back in to the point where it's just like, what? I thought he was a friendly neighbor. I thought surely this isn't gonna hurt me. Surely, whatever the thing is.
SPEAKER_00I know you're tied and I'm in it, but we didn't trust God enough to believe that he was sovereign. God put that person in front of you for a reason. Yeah, good, bad, or indifferent. I think that's the power too. Like, you when you think about well, we can't determine who the enemy is. Yeah, we shouldn't think of anybody as an enemy anyway, because if God put that person in front of me, then therefore he said this person needs to be here. Whether it's to deal with the person I am or to deal with the person in front of me, it's irrelevant. That's not an enemy, it's a person, and he's putting that person in front of you for a reason. Now, I'm not talking about war stuff, right? I'm talking about just life in general, like just real, like real life, right? Like, it's just like, why is that person in front of me? Why is that person causing me this? Why is that person, what is God doing? God is giving you the ability to play the same part he's playing, right? Through through you, he can now do his thing, you know, and I think that's the power that we had to have when we
When Discernment Turns Into Isolation
SPEAKER_00see people in front of us. I love how you said we started to make everybody an enemy, and I and I can attest to that because there was many, many years for me where I was just like, discernment was being misused. Everybody I saw had some type of agenda. Yeah, like it was just never or it was never a thought that they had my best interest at heart. It was always like, what now? What are they gonna do? Like, what are they about to do? You know, like you know, you think like I I I see some people like, oh, I'm so prophetic, I'm all these things. And so you you see the the the the highest, sadly, prophetic people that you see out there for lack of better terms, are probably the most hurt people you see because they don't want no one near them. Yeah. Because they assume that everybody's out to get them because they say that's how they see, they can see your heart and you're evil, is what they're saying, right? They see you better than you can see yourselves. God is giving the giving them this vision about you. Yeah. And so I I can attest to knowing that that was a life I lived for a very long time, and that was a trap, it was imprisonment, right? Like, it was just like to think that every time I see somebody and God shows me something about them, all I can think of was that person's gonna get me. They're trying to hurt me. I need to get far away from them now. I don't need to be in the circle of anybody, no, no need for fellowship.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, I totally agree. Um did you have anything else that you want to throw out there?
SPEAKER_00No, I think I just I talked a lot. I think I did.
SPEAKER_01That's all good.
Read The Word For Yourself
SPEAKER_01Well, hey, um until next time, we pray that you um again never take what we're saying just as the truth from the horse's mouth. Always go back to your own word, always go back and read it for yourself, pray about it. Um, seek God on all of the subject matter. You'll be surprised as to as to what he reveals to you um to to ultimately bring you closer to him. That's all it's all about, anyway. And um, so yeah, we pray that uh y'all have a blessed, wonderful day, week, whatever, until we see you guys again next time. See ya.